hydratrashmeme | Trash Party Dumpster #1

(Will be continued in a Dumpster #2 post if by some unholy hell-miracle this post hits the 5000-comment limit.)

Filthy anon dumpster for sad hobos to fling moldy pizza crusts, raccoon eye makeup tips, and garbage about their sad trash kinks at each other.

AKA the Hydra Trash Party kinkmeme. One hundred percent Hydra Party Favor Bucky Barnes, Is It Sexy Violence Or Violent Sex?, and Bad Guys Do Bad Things To Your Faves: Winter Soldier Edition. BLANKET NON-CON/DUB-CON WARNING, not safe for work, not safe for life, not safe for anyone, read at your own risk ~~of becoming one of us~~.

Rules in brief: don't be a jerk except to fictional characters, warnings for particularly fucked-up garbage are nice but not required, thou shalt not judge the trashiness of thy neighbor's kinks unless thy neighbor is trying to pass off their rotting banana peels and half-eaten pizza crusts as a healthy romantic dinner for two, off-topic comments may be chucked out of the dumpster at management's discretion, management's discretion decrees that omegaverse, soulbond AUs, D/s-verse, non-superpowered AUs, etc. are off-topic.

Organization: hydratrashmeme Pinboard archive maintained by

greenkirtle. If you fill a prompt, drop a link at the fill post. Discussion threads now have a chatter post.

If you want email notifications for new comments here, sign up for a Dreamwidth account and click the little bell icon at the top of this post. To read new comments chronologically rather than in threads, use flat view.

GO TO TOWN, TRASHBABIES.

Unholy hell-miracle achieved! Round 1 is closed; comments and fills in existing threads are still welcome, but all new prompts go to Round 2.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

So you basically have absolutely nothing to say to disprove my arguments and you're just hoping I'll go away so I'd stop making you feel uncomfortable by pointing out how hypocritical and ignorant you are. Maybe I'll go away. I'll probably grow too disgusted with the lot of you to want to continue arguing. Considering the pervasive attitude on this kinkmeme, that's quite likely. Congrats!

I'm not feeling uncomfortable. I was feeling slightly amused, but now I'm bored.

If you were amused, you wouldn't be so eager to see me disappear. :)

New anon chiming in for the first time on this discussion, because I don't like seeing my fellow trash babies upset with each other. I'm a survivor too (of one of those people everyone thinks is a "good guy"); I know how upsetting this topic can be. And I know how that makes it really, really difficult to have a good faith discussion about it in an anonymous context. It's just far too easy to say something out of ignorance of another's experience, or misinterpret things.

But I think I'm safe in believing that nobody here intends to hurt anyone else, or dismiss anyone else's experiences. That anything that comes across otherwise is absolutely unintentional.

So with that in mind:

I do agree that the idea that "good guys" would never do certain bad things is a fairly arbitrary line to draw. I see where the above anon is coming from, in that plenty of apparently "good" people do rape. (Conversely plenty of apparently "bad" people never would.) So the idea that Rumlow or Pierce or Rollins are more believable rapists than Steve or the other Avengers is problematic from that angle: it does tie into the idea that we can (or should) be able to tell whether someone could be a rapist, based on their other behaviour.

However as another anon pointed out, there's a really crucial difference between noncon that is recognised and acknowledged in some way by the author/narrative, and noncon that is treated as A-OK by characters and authors. It seems to me that's what the real issue was with the prompt about Steve being unable to resist: that Steve is seen near-universally as a good person so the prompt could be interpreted as, "Even good people sometimes can't resist raping." Which would be hugely problematic.

I personally think that if a line is to be drawn, it should be drawn to exclude noncon that's presented as unproblematic. So the prompt where Steve can't resist would be fine so long as it's acknowledged that this would make Steve a bad person.

I can't really see why that should be disallowed - we've got all the HYDRA characters doing far more horrific things than we've seen them do in canon, and some trash babies are clearly interested in exploring the idea of Steve being darker than in general fanon, too.

But most importantly I hope we can come to an understanding without anyone ending up hating each other <3

This was very well said, thanks for weighing in on the issue.

Yes I really like this/agree with it.

I'm the original anon and I really couldn't have put it better. Frankly, that someone would look at the prompt would and actually think "Even good people sometimes can't resist raping" instead of "This is how rapists think" is so utterly bizarre for me that I just can't wrap my head around it. That sort of thought process is alien to me, and I assumed, wrongly, apparently, that it's alien to people visiting kinkmemes. This clarification SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BE MADE because the latter should be a person's default way of thinking to begin with. A dark!Steve prompt isn't "Good person does bad things" prompt, it's a "AU where good person is a bad person doing bad things" prompt. This is an obvious and simple damn concept employed in kinkmemes everywhere without causing drama. Why it caused drama here is just beyond me. It's bizarre.

AYRT

It does seem like the misunderstanding here comes from different expectations about kinkmeme communities. If everyone here knew for certain that everyone else was conscious and considerate of the realities of rape culture then yes, a prompt like that may well have been fine without further clarification.

But because none of us knows who anyone else is, I also totally get why people see a prompt like that and are unsure whether to take it as someone prompting a darker Steve-is-not-such-a-good-person-after-all fill, or someone perpetuating the awful sometimes-good-people-just-can't-stop-themselves trope.

I'd personally be against banning all darker interpretations of "good" characters. But either way I do think that extra clarification would help avoid ambiguity and misunderstandings.

New anon; I totally agree. I guess I just really don't see the difference between evil!AU Steve and canon evil Pierce when it's a fantasy noncon kink meme? I also don't get why A/B/O prompts are banned.

The difference is age, life-experience, motivation, circumstances, etc.etc. An awful lot of things, come to think about it.

Sorry, one more response - this is a good comment, and I just wanted to add that the difference, as I see it, between Steve Rogers and all the 'Just Such A Good Guy' rapists who appear just as squeaky-clean as Steve Rogers in real life is that Steve is canonically a good person, which is not something you can ever say about real people.

I'm open to changing my mind to allow prompts that are clearly labeled as an AU dark take on Steve or other superheroes, and in fact after this comment I'm seriously considering it. But let's take it to the rules post to avoid getting more wank on the meme.

Also: noncon preseented as unproblematic has been against meme policy from the very beginning. One of the conditions of playing in this dumpster is being honest about your trash, because Tumblr is already chock full of abusive dynamics getting passed off as fluffy healthy BDSM and people who ship Bucky/Rumlow for real, and that's just not the way we roll here.

Trash Party Dumpster #1

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic

(frozen comment) Re: Clarification re: off-topic