Chatter post

[trashmod]

For all your discussion needs.

Ground rules:
- Try to keep it loosely trash party related, or at least Cap fandom related.
- Disagreement is fine, nastiness is not.
- Being offended is not carte blanche for nastiness.
- Trashmeme ground rules apply. Read at your own risk, no romanticizing your noncon garbage, no wank about the moral acceptability of noncon kink.
- Body shots, sniper shots, and tetanus shots are all available at the open bar. Party like it's 2014, kids.

Comments

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

hey hi. not looking to start any wank, just a different perspective. i've been around the meme pretty much since it started, have been prompting quite a lot and writing every once in a while too. i posted one of the prompts that got frozen (extreme gore and medical torture), since having been around for so long and having dumpster dived quite quite a few times, i got the impression that this is the right place for that kinda content (seeing as it is explicitly banned from a lot of other memes, and actually very in the vibe of what you see a lot on here) and that i could maybe get some feedback on my writing. it's a damn shame that people claiming to be some kinda mysterious kink meme elite had to gang up on innocent folk just wanting to do their writing in peace. like okay, go delete prompts if someone's asking for a fluffy coffeeshop au. but maybe give people space if they want to write gore, cuz there aint anywhere else on the internet that really looks fondly upon it. whatevs tho, yall have a good day

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, I think there are a number of people who prompt/are interested in both the noncon and noncon optional stuff (myself included). It seems disingenuous to claim that noncon-optional content was always frowned upon when some of the most popular fills here have fallen under that category.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

I agree. I understand the volume of not rapey prompts lately might have been bigger than what is optimal for the mod, but for me it's like, it's a mostly Indian restaurant who sometimes served burgers on demand, and everyone was happy eating both Indian and burgers but then a lot of people started demanding burgers so instead of reminding people that the restaurant is mainly Indian, maybe limit the number of burgers served for a while, now nobody can eat burgers anymore.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

also funny story, but having spent six years living on a street where pretty much every other business was an Indian takeaway (in the city where tikka masala was invented, none the less), I can tell you that pretty much every single one served pizza and burgers too. and no one really made a fuss or looked at your weird if you wanted your curry with fries instead of rice, or grabbed a pizza without pakora on it, or just came in for a damn good burger and a coke.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

LOL
Like, I disagree with people saying we need to change the kinds of prompt we accept or the dumpster will die out, because it's been doing okay even though TWS came out four years ago. But it also confuses me how people are suddenly so adamant about there absolutely needing to be noncon, whereas in the past prompts without it were accepted and filled just fine on the premise they had gore, or dehumanization, or more violence than canon.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think anyone wanted anything changed in terms of the rules, just more flexibility in how they were interpreted. Things seem to have become more literal lately than they were.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Exactly. Specially because, like someone mentioned on the other post, people might have different interpretations of trash. Like, the prompt (don't know where the author took the fic cuz I haven't read it yet) where Steve is being milked for his semen to make more serum, for me, while it is definitely sexual and there's humiliation and pain involved, is not necessarily trashy as the scientists were not doing it for evil reasons, but for actual science. It's different from say, HYDRA milking Bucky's prostate by the way of Rumlow's dick.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

True. Also, there's a difference between something being a literal sexual situation, and something that is not inherently sexual in itself, but the reader/writer finds it sexual. For example, bed wetting, vomiting or torture are not inherently sexual activities. However, certain people do find arousal/pleasure/sexual enjoyment in reading/writing about those things, because to them they are sexy. Not sure if I'm explaining this clearly, but for example. A prompt/fill might focus on a character being incontinent as a result of torture. Which on its own isn't a sexual thing. However, to people who view (fictional or not) dehumanization, abuse, desperation etc it will be arousing/sexy.
tl;dr we shouldn't focus explicitly on whether the content involves graphic descriptions of sex on not, provided as it fits with the assignment (HYDRA, Winter Soldier, graphic, distressing content that wouldnt be allowed on other memes) and HAS THE POTENTIAL to be seen as sexual by prompters/writers/readers

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

HYDRA, Winter Soldier, graphic, distressing content that wouldnt be allowed on other memes

That has always been my gauge to post here. Disturbing shit that wouldn't be allowed/welcomed elsewhere being done to CA:TWS characters.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

I'd say "has the potential to be seen as sexual" isn't the best metric, because, well, *anything* could be seen as sexual by someone somewhere. But "HYDRA, Winter Soldier, graphic, distressing content that wouldn't be allowed on other memes" perfectly sums up how I and others here have interpreted "dirtybadwrong". Things that no one in their right mind would wish upon themselves or anyone else, sexual or otherwise.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, and at first, those asking for burgers did so civilly, it wasn't like they stormed the meme. The trolling only started when the debate got heavier, and I think it was only a couple people who were being assholes--most wanted to make genuine points. Also, it's not like the Indian food old-timers were innocent in all this; a few of them reacted as though their content was being threatened, and were defensive to the point of trolling themselves.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

But there is a place for that. The new meme is 100% for that. Go frolic. Enjoy.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Well, yeah, but since the place used to be here as well, it makes sense that a lot of people are confused.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

^^^This. I'm wondering if some of the self-professed elites are actually old-timers, judging from their reaction to content that, although it's been the minority, has been pretty well-recieved up till now.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Fucking this. And people chimed in about this during the wank, and still some people act like it was all newbies getting schooled on how things work around here. We've had some of this stuff for years.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

^^^ Yep. And it wasn't like, say, one or two people prompted something blatantly off-topic, like a fluffy AU, and then raised a stink about it when they were shut down. Most of the recently frozen prompts were similar to preexisting prompts and fills, and seemed to fit with the general tone of the meme even without a sexual element. Judging from the number of people who became involved in the ensuing conversation and what they were saying, this has been a point of confusion for a while; it just hadn't come to a head until now. Implying that the wank was solely the fault of "newbies" (and disparaging newcomers in general) was so out-of-proportion that, frankly, if that's the kind of atmosphere that's going to continue in the main meme, I'd rather take my chances with the new one.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

I'm not sure which part of Trashmod saying "we've let things slide before but this is an inundation so I'm putting my foot down because it's no longer a 'rare exception' thing right now" was unclear for you folks.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

But was it ever "letting anything slide" though? Either it was the recent ratio of noncon-to-noncon optional prompts that was the issue, or some of the most popular and often-recced fills on here were always tolerated at best but that was never made clear.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, I got really upset by all the negativity. In the couple years I've been here I'd never seen the people here being nothing but nice to each other, so I was really surprised. Specially all the hate towards newcomers. Even on anon, it takes guts to come here and ask for disturbing shit, and we already get so much hate from the rest of the fandom, so I really don't get having internal fights over things that were never a problem before.

Even if the problem was about the number of prompts, maybe have a limitation to no two non sexual prompts in a row, or separate post for non sexual kinks, or even a non Sexual Tuesday or something, because "there were too many posts" is kinda vague for newcomers?

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Exactly. It's not a good idea to leave something as a gray area, then get upset when people want to do something within that gray area. If it's isn't expressly forbidden and no caveats are made clear, then people are going to prompt it, sometimes a number of people at once.

And I'm with you about all the negativity--it seemed out-of-nowhere to me too.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

It's like, imagine I have a Stucky meme and I allow OT3 with Peggy as long as there's still Stucky and it's not a love triangle or something. And then some new people arrive and see it's okay to post prompts including Peggy, and they prefer the three of them together instead of just Stucky, so they post a lot of prompts, and then I shut them down because "It's too much Peggy". For me, something is either allowed or not, or allowed within certain parameters, but if the parameters are unclear misunderstandings are bound to happen.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Or we could be absolutely crazy and follow the guidelines we've been given, gasp shock what a concept

It wasn't a problem in the past because it was just a few things here and there and not a constant stream. I thought that was obvious considering how many times it's been pointed out

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Well, apparently it wasn't obvious, not even to some long-time posters. No one was trying to repurpose the meme. That's been made clear more than once.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

I'm having a look through some much much older prompts/ fills right now, and this definitely used to be a place for non-sexual 'extreme' kinks like gore or torture too. Not sure what happened.

Re: Bring out your wank *clangs bell*

[(Anonymous)]

Not just gore/nonsexual kinky stuff, dehumanization/psychological horror/brain damage etc. as well. My impression was that if it was rated-R and if it was the bad guys' fault, it was accepted so long as it wasn't fluffy/too recovery focused.